David Stove and his bizarre inductivist legacy
David Stove. It’s not supposed to be good form to speak ill of the dead so I’ll try to stick to his work. If he didn’t have a cult of personality surrounding him this wouldn’t be necessary.
Way back in the 70s in Sydney University, David Stove spearheaded a counter-attack against an alleged Marxist take over of his department. What Wikipedia won’t tell you is that the Marxists asked for a class to be taught on Marxism, this was the supposed opening volley of the war.
Stove opposed it on the grounds of it being ideological, which at first seems rational. Rational unless you consider that this standard wasn’t applied evenly in view of Stove’s conservative adherence to classical inductivism being essentially polemical rather than “ideologically neutral”.
This first volley (really a reasonable request in and of itself) by the Marxists was enough to trigger a culture warrior response from Stove that was designed to ward off a Marxist take over, effectively meaning that Stove’s justification for denial was a fallacious slippery slope argument. A class isn’t a take over.
Not that I’d want a take-over of Marxist a priorism at my Uni, but I think Stove could have been a little more even handed. It’s not like he was free from contributing to prejudice, ideology and pseudo-science himself.
In the 80s, Stove churned out polemics against philosophers who took Hume’s Problem of Induction seriously (tarring Popper by way of a supposed guilt-by-association with Feyerabend). Stove was a classical inductivist and Hume’s Problem of Induction, if indeed a problem, sounded the death knell for his philosophy. This was in line with Stove’s 1970s attack on Hume’s skepticism*.
Stove is often lionized as possibly Australia’s greatest philosopher of science. This is usually (if not exclusively) by those who happen to hold compatible political views with Stove. Little if any of these people actually take to his work with a critical eye. It’s as John Quiggin said of climate change “skeptics”; so the only people deluded by… [Stove] …on this topic are those complicit in their own delusion, believing an implausible story because it suits their ideological or cultural/tribal prejudices.
And you would have to be deluded (or at least logic impaired) to buy some of the rubbish that Stove was selling.
In Cricket versus Republicanism, Stove told us that there is no reason to assume that women were not innately intellectually inferior to men because of their statistically poorer performance in this respect. Stove didn’t stop there, he also argued that women were intellectually inferior. He also said the same thing of other undesirable traits and race.
Now for some, there is a knee-jerk reaction that says “sexist! racist!”, which usually gets a response along the lines of “politically correct censorship! Whaaaaa! Academic witch-hunt!” While Stove’s views on race and sex may have been unpalatable, being unpalatable didn’t make them wrong.
What made them wrong is that Stove’s assertions were argued cum hoc ergo propter hoc, that is to say he implies causation from correlation which is an act of fallacious logic. Think of it. A philosopher of science who had the education of thousands as his responsibility, incapable of picking up on a basic, formal logical fallacy at the core of his reasoning. Worrying.
There is something that should be said of the conservative fans of Stove; they are inconsistent in their application of Stove’s epistemology. For example, if we used Stove’s cum hoc ergo propter hoc reasoning we could argue; conservatives fare worse in academia, their achievements being statistically less than that of progressives, therefore conservatives are innately inferior at performing in academia.
Suddenly, the Stovian culture warrior will switch from correlation to (spurious) causation as a counter-proof; Marxist / Leftist / post-modern / politically-correct witch hunt! If you go away from this piece with only one idea, go away with this; Stove’s conservative fans don’t reach their conclusions by way of reasoned argument, they select whatever line of argument confirms their prejudice.
If a particular argument of theirs happens to be valid, it’s just a coincidence.
People often talk about group think rhetorically. This fallacious reasoning going un-criticised by Stovians (and their uncritical fans) is an example of true and proper group think. Bolt, Windshuttle et. al.; don’t expect one of them to raise a hand to point out these mistakes.
If we ignore, distort or trivialise causal considerations such as genetic drift while inductively interpreting select data, we can (fallaciously) argue about “kinds” of organisms that differentiated after their ride on Noah’s Ark just like Ken Ham does. You can see what Ken Ham is up to with his “kinds”, along with point-by-point coverage of his errata here on YouTube. (Warning: about 45mins long).
You can argue almost anything if you selectively include or exclude considerations of causality and do it inductively. Stove was overly dismissive of existing and potential sociological and environmental (i.e. causal) factors when he declared women intellectually inferior to men. You can see why this kind of epistemology is popular with propagandists of an instrumentalist leaning.
Keith Windschuttle in his book The Killing of History, in a foreword before expanding upon Stove’s attack on Karl Popper** , Windschuttle at least paid due respect to part of Popper’s philosophy of science. He acknowledged that Popper’s falsificationism had kept shonks out of the sciences.
I think we should consider this a confession as to why Stove is so popular amongst conservative culture warriors. Whatever his intentions, this is what Stove has left us.
~ Bruce
* Incidentally, when you hear a global warming denier call themselves a skeptic, check if they are classical inductivists. Very often with prominent Australian “climate change skeptics” you can find a chain of uncritical and unwavering parroting of inductivists leading back to David Stove (usually through Keith Windschuttle, “climate change skeptics” often being “Stolen Generation Skeptics” as well). Also familiarise yourself with Marcello Truzzi’s piece on pseudo-skepticism (don’t worry about the “New Age” font, it’s a parody). If you can get your head around it, you’ll soon realise that these “climate change skeptics” are nothing of the sort.
** For crying out loud Windschuttle/Stove, “neutralising success words”? “Jazz age”? It’s epistemology/philosophy of science, not aesthetics!











There’s not much sign of engagement with Stove’s arguments there. His identification of Popper’s deductivism has nothing to do with “guilt by association” with Feyerabend, while his argument about women is not about causation from correlation. He was a classical inductivist (well, sort of classical, having written a boook on the justification of induction using an argument that is not exactly classical). But then, you don’t say what you think is wrong with (his version of) inductivism. He’d have recommended you do that.
There’s not much sign of engagement with Stove’s arguments there.
Perhaps. But there is a point where engagement with sophistry becomes counter-productive, not to mention, unnecessary.
His identification of Popper’s deductivism has nothing to do with “guilt by association” with Feyerabend…
He made a number of arguments, and one of them was a tarring by way of “guilt by association”. Reading Popper and After: Four Modern Irrationalists (and subsequent editions) makes this abundantly clear.
Are you going to tell me that “postmodern cult” isn’t in any way a(n inaccurate) pejorative association? Please.
Sorry James but after this, I don’t think I can take you as seriously as I’d like to. Especially as you mis-characterise my mention of Stove’s tarring of Popper; I only mentioned it as an aside.
…his argument about women is not about causation from correlation
Well I’ll let my readers decide on that. I’ll give them a quote of Stove’s to work with;
“The main reason why I believe, and the main reason why nearly everyone always has believed, that the intellectual capacity of women is inferior to that of men, is just this: that the intellectual performance of women is inferior to that of men.”
Quote taken from here if people want to see Stove’s evidence. For those other than James reading this, this is hosted on a Uni NSW site run by James. A game of spot the fallacy may be in order.
But then, you don’t say what you think is wrong with (his version of) inductivism.
Well, I did point out what I thought was somewhat of an auto-reductio ad absurdum. I will confess though that I could have gone further though in voicing my objection, than simply pointing to absurdity.
My chief objection is that inductivism caters to prejudice, which may be used in lieu of consideration of causality. For example, Black people having statistically lower IQs could purely be attributed to a narrow kind of economic oppression from a strict Maxist perspective, or an innate genetic disposition from a racist perspective. The causes however may be manifold and be neither that put forward by a narrow Marxist explanation, or a racist explanation.
Richard Dawkins in The God Delusion demonstrates an excellent example of avoiding this kind of reasoning when he talks about the moral statistics of atheists versus theists.
“Correlational evidence is never conclusive, but the
following data, described by Sam Harris in his Letter to a Christian Nation, are nevertheless striking.” – The God Delusion, p. 229 (emphasis is mine).
He’d have recommended you do that.
A rather fawning argument from authority. Top bloke phenomena? In any case, I may put a critique of The intellectual Capacity of Women on the cards. Although it will have to wait for the rest of the stuff I have on my list.
Maybe I’ll write a post about the “Stove-inductivist cult” myself: The cult of personality that surrounds Stove, Wikipedia vandalism that tried to turn Stove’s entry into some kind of shrine, appeals to Stove’s authority and how his inductivism appeals to prejudice (thus attracting those who want to believe what is most palatable – another cult trait).
Anyway, I’m on a kind of blog hiatus at the moment (like much of the local blogosphere it seems) so I won’t be able to be entirely attentive in this discussion. This comment is getting long enough as it is.
I’ll close in saying that I expected you to turn up a little earlier, James.
I’ll just point out correlation is necessary (but not always sufficient) to show causation.
The corollary being that only showing correlation does not negate the possibility of causation.
I haven’t seen the source material, but reading the post you seem to claim someone is arguing causation from correlation only without giving explicit reasons. Surely you’re not arguing by assertion?
I haven’t seen the source material, but reading the post you seem to claim someone is arguing causation from correlation only without giving explicit reasons. Surely you’re not arguing by assertion?
Nope. This is just one of those shorter posts that relies on readers having done a bit of reading.
Not 100% sure that writing about David Stove is what I want to spend a lot of my time on on this blog though. How interested are you in Stove, John?
Hi Bruce,
I wouldn’t've made my comment had you put the link to Stove’s disquisition in the body of the post.
I haven’t read Stove’s works, so I have no particular interest in him. In fact, since you linked to the article in question in your response to James, I’ve been able to read it and find its reasoning specious. It does not predispose me to read further.
I’d personally not characterise it as causation from correlation so much as justification of an a-priori opinion based on correlation (admittedly, Stove writes “The reasoning involved, then, is reasoning from inferior performance to inferior capacity.”).
Stove begins by asserting an opinion, claiming that opinion has historically been commonly held, and that he finds no convincing evidence for the more modern contrary claim.
He digresses at length to say opinions on this matter can only be determined probabistically, and reiterates that historical evidence constitutes convincing probabilistic evidence.
He attempts an ad-hoc explanation based on evolutionary psychology (in the same vein as Desmond Morris), but then goes on to say “Here is something which would not convince me of the equality-theory: reports by psychologists or educationists of tests, conducted within recent years, on (for example) the comparative mathematical ability of boys and girls.”
There’s more, but I tire of this – it’s extremely verbose and his disdain for experts is evident and not to his credit.
A last quote from the piece, my bolds:
—- begin quote
What would convince me of the equal intellectual capacity of men and women is, simply, the kind of evidence which, as things are, convinces me of the opposite: that is, equal intellectual performance, over a long time, and in the widest variety of circumstances.
Nothing else would convince me, or even begin to do so. In particular, no experiments of any kind, however well-conducted, would weigh with me, if their results were inconsistent with the verdict of ordinary experience. If intellectual performance continued to be, as it has always been, unequal, in all the limitless and largely-undesigned variety of life, then that is the evidence I would trust. If all the educationists (etc.) in the world, even without the influence of fraud or self-deception, reported equal intellectual performance by the juveniles of either sex, it would cut no ice with me; and similarly if all the geneticists and molecular biologists could not detect, by their most refined experiments, any physical basis for the unequal performance of the two sexes. I would still stand by the evidence, raw and unanalysed as it is, of a long and varied experience, if that still testifiled to inequality.
—-end quote
I note that David Stove published the above in 1990, and since then there’s been social change.
—begin quote
Over the past decade there has been considerable community concern about the level of achievement attained by boys in Australian schools.
An inquiry into the education of boys in Australian schools was conducted in 2002 by the House of Representatives Standing Committee on Education and Training found that overall, while many boys in Australian schools are doing well, boys are not achieving as well as girls across a range of educational and social measures.
Some areas of concern for boys compared to girls are their lower literacy achievement, lower school retention and lower levels of participation in higher education. Boys also have higher rates of school exclusion. There is also evidence that boys’ performance as a group in areas such as literacy has declined over time.
—end quote
Hm.
I’m not following your argument.
First, you say Stove’s arguments are bad because of their form of inductivism:
“What made them wrong is that Stove’s assertions were argued cum hoc ergo propter hoc, that is to say he implies causation from correlation which is an act of fallacious logic.”
Second, you say Stovians are good because they are not consistently inductive:
“There is something that should be said of the conservative fans of Stove; they are inconsistent in their application of Stove’s epistemology.”
Finally, you say such inconsistency is bad because people can use it to argue for anything:
“You can argue almost anything if you [A] selectively include or exclude considerations of causality and [B] do it inductively. ”
You are mixing up two issues here. Someone can argue almost anything if they A. Adding or excluding B doesn’t change anything. In fact, not A & B can be sound, and A & not B is still unsound.
So, the real problem here is that Stovians are A, even though you originally commend them for this. Despite the lead up, B is irrelevant.
That being said, good work on getting David Stove’s name on the web. Not enough people know about the guy. Right or wrong, he does make a lot of interesting arguments that are at least fun to analyze. I recently read “Against the Idols of the Age” myself. Highly recommended.
I’m not following your argument… Second, you say Stovians are good because they are not consistently inductive.
I guess that’s one of the hazards of my use of sarcasm -about it being a good thing in this case.
You are mixing up two issues here.
Indeed I am.
Someone can argue almost anything if they A. Adding or excluding B doesn’t change anything.
I disagree. I think in practice B, used exclusively, makes A more effective a confirming prejudice. The “I’ve got an uncle…” or other inductive “proofs” brought forward by denialist pseudo-skeptics come to mind.
I was out looking for Shermer’s Denying History in stores today. Wasn’t in stock sadly. I think it would be rather on-topic.
At any rate, when B results in post hoc ergo propter hoc, as it does in Stove’s inductive racism, it is problematic. Even without A.
(And I know it’s been argued that Stove isn’t asserting causality, however unless he is rejecting cause and effect – something too anarchic for someone taking his position – his assertions of innate differences necessarily imply a causality, even if he didn’t profess to know what it was.)
So, the real problem here is that Stovians are A, even though you originally commend them for this. Despite the lead up, B is irrelevant.
I didn’t and I don’t think B is.
Right or wrong, he does make a lot of interesting arguments that are at least fun to analyze.
As with most philosophers, I think he would have made a much better interlocutor than those he left behind. All those un-answered questions. All that taking and running with his philosophy that he can’t observe and comment on.
I think something can be said for his cheek as well.
What is curious is that it has been indeed found that women perform worse than men in the highest IQs. They have the same average, but there are less women at the extreme ends of IQ.
And when I hit this page from Google I was hoping to see something interesting about Stove. Nothing but ad hominem, really, ironically accusing him of doing just the same.
Very disappointed.
And no, I’m not a “David Stove”’s fan, to anticipate the all-too-obvious fallacy you would make against me.
What is curious is that it has been indeed found that women perform worse than men in the highest IQs. They have the same average, but there are less women at the extreme ends of IQ.
Which is uncontroversial and doesn’t support what Stove says.
Nothing but ad hominem, really, ironically accusing him of doing just the same.
Please elaborate. Where have I predicated a conclusion upon an irrelevant character flaw etc.?
Very disappointed.
Can’t say I am.